Machiventa Melchizedek, Planetary Manager
- The convergence continues
- Our concerns are for everyone, particularly in democratic nations
- Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano
- Referendums a precursor to evolution of democracy
- Capital punishment, judgment and the seven values
- All of us will be judged at some point
- A distinction between morality of society and the morality of individuals
- The 12-Step program of Alcoholics Anonymous
- The Ancients of Days
- Adjudication and Adjuster Fusion
- Making choices through the democratic process
- Judgment and mercy
- The seven core values will become ubiquitous over time
- Net worth of individuals over money, not seven values
- Some people do not learn by experience
- The polarization in the New Era to a lesser degree
- Seek your Thought Adjuster as your best source to go to
Transmitter/Receiver: Daniel Raphael, PhD
Members present: Craig Carmichael, Liz Cratty, Jeff Cutler and Stéphane Labonteé.
August 27, 2018
1. The convergence continues
MACHIVENTA: Good morning, this is Machiventa. I have given my assent that I would be here and be glad to speak with you. The convergence continues and as you will see eventually, not immediately. Eventually you will see many wonderful things that you have gained out of these convergences. You, yourselves can identify these convergences by the intentions for their existences, of why people come together for purposes of their work and the hope of the future and the contributions to this and all following generations. These are already in motion; we already have traction, as you say, about some of these concepts and developments and there are many people outside of the Teaching Mission, Magisterial Mission, etc., who have begun to work their projects within the convergence to develop it into more meaningful and practical ways in their social existence. And when we say “social existence,” we mean in all organizations, anything having to do with two or more people with intention of doing something together, whether that is in trading cabbages in the garden, or for beef, or for fertilizer or for something else. This is an organization in intention. And through these informal convergences even with as few as two people, there will be ideas shared and thoughts considered and possibilities again discussed, and this is the beginning of a grassroots spiritual consciousness on your planet to heal the immense moral and ethical deficits that exist in your world.
2. Our concerns are for everyone, particularly in democratic nations
Our concerns are for everyone, of course, but organizationally and socially our concerns are principally centered around democratic nations, democratic governance, democratic processes for these are the only political entities that have any hope of existing into a far and distant future. Other forms of governance such as communism, socialism—strict socialism—and other forms without democratic process will ultimately fail—all of them will fail. It is essential that we and you focus our intention for insuring that the democratic process in all democratic nations evolves and is improved. As you know from your own work and knowledge about democratic nations around the world, whether it is Germany, England, France, Switzerland or many others that they have fulfilled their original intentions. The evolved intentions that they must seek to fulfill is the intention to exist indefinitely into the future, and by that we mean to become self-sufficient, self-sustaining so that the processes and the intentions both work together to sustain the nation into a far distant future. As you can see from your own nation, there is much work to do.
I am open for questions if you have any.
Liz: I don’t have any prepared questions this morning; I wanted to say that I am seeing—maybe because my eyes have been opened and I know where to look—but I see a tremendous movement toward doing the right thing. So, I honor you and Christ Michael and Nebadonia and your work because I can see the fruits of your labors.
MACHIVENTA: Thank you.
3. Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano
Jeff: I don’t have any prepared questions for the syllabus or the course work, but over the weekend, I read a commentary on the Archbishop Vigano’s exposé and I am not Roman Catholic, nor have I ever been, but my heart certainly goes out to the people of Pennsylvania who anguish about all of this. Is this appropriate for you to comment about this at this time?
MACHIVENTA: We refrain from discussing this topic; it speaks for itself.
4. Referendums a precursor to evolution of democracy
Craig: On the democracy topic, I noticed that some of the states in the United States have permitted citizens to cause a referendum to be held, which they call an initiative, and I personally have felt that this is about the most positive sort of structural development in my lifetime, of the evolution of democracy. Would you care to comment on that?
MACHIVENTA: Yes, gladly. As you see, the initiative referendum process is a precursor to the local community design teams for the design and validation process. The topics the design team can act on are multiple ways, both social, political, economic local, national and so forth. It is a process that is far advanced of the referendum process as its very beginnings brings minds together to come up with—not a consensus—but a well thought out intelligent solution or suggestions for solutions to a problem. There are no limitations to the recommendations that a design team can make; they can make recommendations for changing a State Constitution or National Constitution; they can come up with a new design for the democratic process and initiate that within their own local area. The wonderful thing of the design team process is that it is open to anyone and everyone and is a thoughtful process. This means that the mental intelligence, intellectual and educated, resources of a nation can be brought to bear in the association of many thousands of minds on a problem.
What will erupt out of that is the necessity for compiling or for collecting those shared insights by teams, and some means by which teams can access the findings of other teams, and then begin associating them into larger solutions for larger problems. This has been discussed some months and years ago, as what This One calls the “Library for Sustaining Human Wisdom.” As it was suggested before, this would best work as an online library that could be accessed by anyone and would have someone, or some process to associate the issues so the results could be found. You have a very similar process in Wikipedia, as in Wikiquotes and “Wikieverything” else that enables individuals to find what they are looking for, which gives them more options for developing their own thinking and solutions. We appreciate your question.
Craig: You answered my next question as well, which was about whether the referendum or initiative process could be used to advance and evolve democracy further. So, I understand that you are saying that design teams can get input from everyone, and then I suppose at the end of the process, make a recommendation which would then be voted on by the populous?
MACHIVENTA: Yes, I’m biting my lips as a human would, saying that is a naïve approach, but yes, it is a workable beginning. It is essential that people physically meet together, rather than online to work through these problems. Later on the libraries will be developed and referenced much as academics do to use those references to work on their own projects. Nonetheless, it is always enhanced immensely by the synergy that occurs within a design team, as minds come together and develop new ideas and thoughts and creativity and options for the problem or situation. How it is then presented to the public to be voted on is another thing to consider. We know and you know that there is more than one option to the solution of problems, and that perhaps it may be more workable, rather than either/or voting, for this or approving it or denying the vote for it, that there be a preference selection given to voters so they have a wider spectrum of options to chose from. This would then invoke the thinking and discernment of the voting public, the individual to consider options and to weigh/discern them. It is our intention in supporting this development, both in the democratic process and design teams, that it become an educational process, a learning process for the teams to provide a learning function to the public and to themselves and to the broader public of the nation and states. When this occurs, then you will have progress achieved an evolutionary progress in your social existence.
Craig: I’m sure my comprehension will grow as I consider the transcript.
5. Capital punishment, judgment and the seven values
Stéphane: (Joining a few minutes late,) I haven’t followed the stream, but I do have a few questions that may be completely off topic, but in the last sessions capital punishment was mentioned for predators as a response from society. My question is around judgment: How is judgment implemented after this life? Is it purely based on the seven values and how is it differentiated from say someone who kills someone personally, or society taking capital punishment on someone deemed to be a menace to society?
MACHIVENTA: Are you, in your usage of the word “judgment,” are you talking about the judgment by the Ancients of Days?
6. All of us will be judged at some point
Stéphane: Yes. I’m not sure if there are different types of judgment, but we all will be judged at some point based on our activities on earth?
MACHIVENTA: Gladly. The principle judgment of the Ancients of Days is usually along these lines: The willingness of the individual to be in compliance, or not only in compliance with God’s Will, but who wills to do God’s Will in their lifetime. It is also an element of the intention, the intent of a person as they lead their life as a mortal; those are the considerations. The seven values are your text book guidelines for living your life as an ethical and moral individual in a social world. This helps prepare you for your own transition and your eventual judgment, when your intention is in alignment with doing God’s Will, then you will be judged aright by the Ancients of Days. Your question is important as it brings a distinction to life here and elsewhere.
Stéphane: Affecting their judgments, the Ancients of Days do take into consideration acts that were done based on someone’s own decision, or somebody was following another order or somebody else’s order, in this case society’s order to capital punishment of predators.
7. A distinction between morality of society and the morality of individuals
MACHIVENTA: If I follow your question correctly, there is a distinction between social morality of society and the personal morality of individuals. The society acts as a group decision to remove people, as you call capital punishment, which is a misnomer, as it is not an immoral offense. Even the individual who is the executioner in that case is not morally culpable in that situation where it was ordered by society or by the courts. Does this attempt to answer your question?
Stéphane: Yes, so it is between social morality and personal morality.
8. The 12-Step program of Alcoholics Anonymous
Jeff: I’d like to follow-up on Stéphane’s question. I asked you a while back if the 12-Step program for the aid of people with alcoholism was divinely inspired and you answered yes. My understanding is that part of that process is to go to people that you have harmed and apologize to them with sincerity for the harm that you have done him or her. Is part of the adjudication by the Ancients of Days dependent upon a rehabilitation system that is similar to that 12-Step program?
MACHIVENTA: No. The measurement is the intention of the individual. For instance, there may be individuals who go to those they have offended and apologize only as a requirement of the 12-Steps; they would not be sincere, would they? And so they would be in moral arrearage, so to speak, of their duties to the seven steps and to their effectiveness to be healed. The Ancients of Days, their spectrum of consideration for the finality of the decision takes into consideration the capability of the individual to become open to remediation, whether they can be healed. Only the individual can heal themselves; there is an immense amount of spiritual support for anyone who sees what they have done and is very remorseful about that situation and wishes to proceed in their ascendant career.
9. The Ancients of Days
All of those things are very evident to the Ancients of Days; in fact there is a transparency in the soul record of that individual which is easily read by the Ancients immediately; it only takes mere moments, or parts of moments to adjudicate the individual. When you consider the work of the Ancients of Days, and that the trillions of individuals who are passing under their scrutiny, these decisions come quickly due to the clarity of the record of the individual soul. Empty souls, of course, have nothing there to read and that individual has made a statement to themselves by the acts of omission to not move themselves forward morally and ethically in the lives of others, and particularly not to be of service to themselves and to others nor to make ethical and moral decisions. You too, could make such decisions if you have the clarity of the soul record and you could read that, and even if you were an adjunct to the Ancients of Days without the authority of final judgment, you could easily come to similar conclusions yourself.
10. Adjudication and Adjuster Fusion
Stéphane: Machiventa, does everyone get judged at some point before Adjuster Fusion?
MACHIVENTA: Yes, most definitely. The Adjuster Fusion comes long after, or after your adjudication. For those individuals who are sleeping survivors, they must wait for the dispensation to arise from that situation, and they are judged at that time. If you are a God believing individual who wills to do God’s Will and you pass through this, your judgment will occur within three days before you arrive at the Resurrection Halls.
Stéphane: So this judgment happens at your resurrection at Mansonia, or just prior to?
Stéphane: And then it could happen thereafter depending on circumstances, it could happen again before fusion?
MACHIVENTA: We prefer not to elucidate too much on this, as there will become much erroneous speculation among readers as to how this occurs, when does it occur, what happens during the three days, and so on. Those three days are an era of mystery, and we prefer to keep it that way.
11. Making choices through the democratic process
Craig: Back to the topic of making design team selections for the democratic process, or through the democratic process, I’ve always felt that the single ballot—I call it the “Illiterate’s X ballot”—is polarizing and limiting in choices, that a range of options is that which people can rank, so I would say that the proper way to vote is to rank the choices and then drop each least popular choice until one choice has the majority. So would that be the way it is done on most planets?
MACHIVENTA: Let us concern yourself only with Urantia. That is certainly an option that is available through one of many options in the democratic process for making selections. It is a process… whatever process is chosen must be the process that has been discerned by the voters and they choose which one they prefer to use. Remember too, that the process of choosing, the outcome may vary or differ depending on the topic that is involved, that is discussed.
Craig: I guess my main point was just that in order to have a range of options, you have to have a way to select between them, rather than just a “this or that” choice, which tends to make the option that is most different often win even though it is chosen by a minority. The other options that are more similar, any one of them would be chosen by the majority but they “split the vote” and so the minority option wins the vote instead. That’s what I see as something that needs to be addressed and changed.
MACHIVENTA: That sounds like a good topic for a local design team, does it not?
Craig: (Laughing.) Right!
12. Judgment and mercy
Liz: This whole concept of judgment troubles me because my only frame of reference is human judgment and one of the things I love about my relationship with the Heavenly Father and my Thought Adjuster and Christ Michael is the opportunity of mercy. So when we talk about judgment, I don’t know what that means from your perspective, nor do I understand where mercy comes into the equation.
MACHIVENTA: We refer you to your Urantia Book, which discusses this very thoroughly in the text. Mercy and justice are important facets of judgment. Mercy must be extended throughout the whole process of the ascendant career of the individual to see that there may be potential for them to be rehabilitated or to be saved. (Machiventa: neither of those words set right with me in this discussion.) The act of judgment for an individual who’s Thought Adjuster has vacated that individual’s mind, and that this person is conscious and awake and has thoroughly denied the existence of God and has chosen deliberately not to do God’s Will and wants to continue to wreak havoc and violence upon other people, is very simple.
The judgment of the Ancients of Days in this case is immediate and that this person would be part of the sleeping survivors, and there would be as you have seen in your Grimm’s Fairytales and such, the Grim Reaper where a scythe cut of the Grim Reaper takes away all of those individuals where there is absolutely no hope of saving this individual and they have no hope of being saved and do not care to be saved. There, this distinction is very great. Their mercy has already been granted long before the mortal came into existence, knowing that mercy is always available for the individual who has even the slightest inkling that there may be a God, and the slightest inkling that maybe that good exists in them, and maybe there is a possibility of doing good in their life, whether they would be saved or not. You see, mercy always exists… (Interruption that disturbed Daniel’s link with Machiventa.)
[This is Daniel: I can’t carry that discussion further.]
Liz: I’m going to bring this up again next time. I will do my research; this is something that is near and dear to my heart and I appreciate Machiventa’s clarity and I feel like he didn’t get a chance to finish, so with his permission I will pursue this next time.
13. The seven core values will become ubiquitous over time
Jeff: Earlier in the conversation today, it was stated that the seven core values are a logical place to validate so many different things that it should become—I’m reading between the lines here—ubiquitous over a period of time. Is that your understanding, or your belief?
MACHIVENTA: That’s our recommendation, yes.
Jeff: So, to add on to that, for something like this to become very widespread and accepted as a benchmark for arriving at what may be laws, rules or behavioral norms there has to be some sort of a buildup of the authority by which this model is employed. What comes to my mind as “SPQR, Senātus Populusque Rōmānus” that was carried by Roman Legions to establish the authority for what they were doing. My question here is: Is there something that we can do along with trying to build educational material that would lend authority to the use of this model?
MACHIVENTA: Yes, most definitely. Now you have started to connect the dots between the seven values, embedding them and investing them in organizations, and the work of the local community design teams, which can also act as participants in the democratic process. Teams can recommend changes to existing bodies and can become politically active in the democratic process to recommend bills and legislation and so on. They can also become generators of reliable candidates, and that each possible candidate would have a brief synopsis of their lives, careers, and values and that this would be available through your electronic devices when you scroll down and highlight their name, etc. You have many processes that can help bring the values into the public process and then to the democratic process of your nation and all organizations.
Jeff: Wouldn’t it be nice if that was available to us coming up to this November?
MACHIVENTA: We have made these suggestions many years ago, but no one listened.
Craig: I think that would be fantastic if we could actually find a reliable bio of the candidates that are running.
14. Net worth of individuals over money, not seven values
Stéphane: If you look at the current makeup of governments today, most of them have a large wealth, a net value associated—I think I heard the average net worth of Senate members is 15 million dollars, and so if you were to do this comparison of each individual as per the seven values, I think you would find a leaning towards one end of the spectrum at the current moment. Would you agree with that?
MACHIVENTA: That would be most difficult to assess, as there are individuals who have very little money, who would also think that a person who has lots of money would be a good person to vote for. Other individuals would vote the other way. The assessment of money is not a good criterion to use in the assessment of an individual’s capability to make wise and discerning opinions, votes, and choices. We are striving to bring democratic process around to a more intelligent and well balanced spectrum of candidates to assist the evolution of your nation and all democratic nations. This is a culture-changing process, and as you know will take decades.
15. Some people do not learn by experience
The incident you mentioned as the election of 2016 and eventually of 2018 and 2020 is such that this is the moral crisis that is needed to make and convince people to think more reasonably and rationally and logically. There are some, as you know in all nations who no matter if they are right or wrong will still vote the same way. These people are those who do not learn by experience and there is little hope for assisting them to learn otherwise as they are adamant in their opinions, and even when they accept other options, they continue to vote the way they have always voted. This is the height of the human error.
16. The polarization in the New Era to a lesser degree
Stéphane: Machiventa, you said before that you have no preference for a two-party system over a multi-party system. Even with a multi-party system there seems to be polarization from liberal and conservative factions. How do you see this polarization progressing in the new era?
MACHIVENTA: In the New Era there will continue to be polarization, but not the extreme polarization that you see today. Yes, there will be the conservative side and the liberal side even when the seven values, morality, and ethics are discussed. It will be a huge step of progress if that were the context, that there would be ethics and morality and the seven values would be considered in choices and decisions. Yet, there would be a conservative side to that and a liberal side to that and we have no objections to that. That will continue for many centuries. In the advent of the Days of Light and Life, it becomes more and more porous that government is not needed, that people become self-governing and that there will be individuals who want to be strictly conservative and others who are still liberal and who go their own way. This is an evident fact even in worlds that are developed, even those that have been in the Days of Light and Life for a long time. Individuals still have free choice and that will continue to be exercised even to the last days until the next stage of the seventh stage of the universe.
[This is Daniel: I’ve had a really tough week in many regards and I didn’t sleep well last night and so with your forgiveness I would like to bring this to a close.
Craig: Sounds like a great idea.
Liz: Do we have parting words from Machiventa?]
17. Seek your Thought Adjuster as your best source to go to
MACHIVENTA: We hear the earnestness in your voices; we hear the emotional attachment to these topics. But if you are a discerning member of this team you will already have discerned that there is some fragmentation and diminishment of returns in the topics we have been pursuing. We are deeply grateful for your thoughts, for your insights, for your delving into these topics. The topics of ethics and morality has been very exciting for us to see how you have worked your way through these topics, these situations, and the issues of morality in your current and future organizations of your society. Know that your Thought Adjuster is always the best source to go to for the decisions and discussions of the topics you wish to use. You must consider too, with a bit of humor, that your Thought Adjuster is the ultimate “Wikipedia” of universe knowledge and wisdom. This is why we always suggest that you go to meditation and be open to receive your Thought Adjuster’s sharing, whether that is in silence or that is in open discussion with you. Know that we are here to support you in all regards when you wish to do the Father’s Will, even if it is a mere thought of “maybe I ought to do that.” Thank you and good day.
Machiventa Melchizedek - New Era Transition 46 - August 27, 2018 - Daniel Raphael, Colorado, US
Received by Daniel Raphael, Ph.D.
Session: August 27, 2018